slufan13 Posted March 31, 2015 Author Share Posted March 31, 2015 I'd like to get a lot quicker in the backcourt. I remember Stevens saying after we won at Butler that Mitchell, Jett, and McCall were just flat out fast. That team had bigs who knew how to set screens, guards who knew how to take them, and guards who were quick and explosive. Maybe some of these current guards can get more explosive, but I always find it tough to get a whole lot quicker. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianstl Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 I'd like to get a lot quicker in the backcourt. I remember Stevens saying after we won at Butler that Mitchell, Jett, and McCall were just flat out fast. That team had bigs who knew how to set screens, guards who knew how to take them, and guards who were quick and explosive. Maybe some of these current guards can get more explosive, but I always find it tough to get a whole lot quicker. It seems at times to me the staff has become more enamored with recruiting a team that looks like a basketball team than actually functions like a basketball team. This current roster looks like a basketball when it walks through the airport , but didn't look like a very good one on the court. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clock_Tower Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 You make some good points. I think the key is being VERY selective this spring if we are going to use that last available scholarship. No projects or developmental players. Agreed, a 5th year player would be a good fit. IF it winds up that we just have one available heading into next year, obviously we hold it for JT. And if/when we land JT this fall, I am confident that when a scholarship or two opens in the spring of 2016, we would have a lot of quality players interesting in playing with JT. We have had plenty of posts and even another thread about Tatum so I don't want to rehash more of it here, but now that I think about it, the last few times we signed top local players (Claggett, Highmark, Winfield came along with Bickel, Grant and Grawer) and also (Larry Hughes came along with Baniak and Tatum). I am not sure if Lisch and Liddell coordinated things themselves or not. But offering not only Tatum but Tatum and a friend or 2 would sure seem to increase our odds. If so, another reason to have at least 2 scholarships ready to offer next Fall (and a verbal promise to bring in another friend in the Spring) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianstl Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 If my memory is correct Baniak , Tatum and Heinrich all committed to SLU before Hughes. I am positive Tatum did and I am pretty sure the other two did, too. It wasn't that Hughes attracted the other quality recruits, but landing them helped convince Larry to stay home. Seems like people expect it to work the other way around this time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLU_Nick Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 I actually think Miles is the fastest guard we've had for a while...including the 3 you mentioned. He just need to get stronger with the ball while flying around the court. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kshoe Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 If my memory is correct Baniak , Tatum and Heinrich all committed to SLU before Hughes. I am positive Tatum did and I am pretty sure the other two did, too. It wasn't that Hughes attracted the other quality recruits, but landing them helped convince Larry to stay home. Seems like people expect it to work the other way around this time. I'm virtually certain the order of commitment was Tatum, Hughes, Baniak and Heinrich. As for Lisch and Liddell (Clock's post) they were in different classes until Tommy failed to qualify and had to do a year of prep school so I highly doubt they coordinated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clock_Tower Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 It seems at times to me the staff has become more enamored with recruiting a team that looks like a basketball team than actually functions like a basketball team. This current roster looks like a basketball when it walks through the airport , but didn't look like a very good one on the court. Agreed. But keep in mind that Crews struck out on his early decisions (that McBroom would be our PG and that Manning/Glaze would be able to handle the interior last year). But since then, decisions look better -- we all knew that Reggie was a project (very limited basketball prior to SLU) -- at least he appears to be improving and turning the corner, Crawford (played lower level high school ball and not much AAU ball) who also is turning it on, Ash (who was decent but not great to lead us last year) and Tanner would be the next Cody Ellis. And even better decisions were last year's 6 Freshmen who look good for the future - if not the present/last year. A year later, Crews has shown the balls to both clear house and the skills in retaining all 6 Frosh as well as to bring in Neufeld and Jermaine Bishop, both of whom look good, as well as Welmer for whom I have hope. Now, I still have questions about how/why Crews felt like McBroom could/would be his PG after having coached him for 2 years; how he could offer 2 bigs this past Fall (instead of guard help); his team's performances on the floor the past 3 years (offensive and defensive efficiencies appear going in the wrong direction) as well as his decisions to not man the FT line, to not learn inbound plays and to not learn how to set/use screens. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clock_Tower Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 I'm virtually certain the order of commitment was Tatum, Hughes, Baniak and Heinrich. As for Lisch and Liddell (Clock's post) they were in different classes until Tommy failed to qualify and had to do a year of prep school so I highly doubt they coordinated. Heinrich definitely was the last of the 4 but when were the decisions made as opposed to announced? Very likely that Justin was given his day in the sun first before Larry made his decision and that Matt then waited a short while to announce his as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ACE Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 I'd like to get a lot quicker in the backcourt. I remember Stevens saying after we won at Butler that Mitchell, Jett, and McCall were just flat out fast. That team had bigs who knew how to set screens, guards who knew how to take them, and guards who were quick and explosive. Maybe some of these current guards can get more explosive, but I always find it tough to get a whole lot quicker. Agreed. Even when we were rolling, we would get posts on our board about how we needed bigger guards. Give me quick guards every time. It seems JC got a bit away from the RM approach. I know it sounds simple, but get guys who can play and don't get so hung up if a player is an inch or two shorter than the ideal height at a particular position, especially at guard. There were so many times our smallish guards would run circles around taller guards. For example, we made Abdul Gady look like a joke when we played Romar's bunch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Box and Won Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 Agreed. Even when we were rolling, we would get posts on our board about how we needed bigger guards. Typically after Temple games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ACE Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 Typically after Temple games. Haha! Correct. I think having one Femi or DR type player would have helped that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zink Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 I actually think Miles is the fastest guard we've had for a while...including the 3 you mentioned. He just need to get stronger with the ball while flying around the court. He is very fast, but not shifty/quick/agile like the three amigos. If he has a straight line to the bucket, he can beat his man. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dwayne's_World Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 If Miles and Bartley work extremely hard in the offseason to add about 15-20 lbs of muscle (which is not hard for guys that are already skinny), then they will be much more effective at driving on their man into the paint. That factor alone will cause drastic improvements to our offense, considering that neither seemed capable last season of doing anything more than drawing a foul or getting the ball swatted away when driving. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3star_recruit Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 If Miles and Bartley work extremely hard in the offseason to add about 15-20 lbs of muscle (which is not hard for guys that are already skinny), then they will be much more effective at driving on their man into the paint. That factor alone will cause drastic improvements to our offense, considering that neither seemed capable last season of doing anything more than drawing a foul or getting the ball swatted away when driving. I'd settle for 8-10 lb of muscle and a midrange game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidnark Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 I'd settle for 8-10 lb of muscle and a midrange game. I agree that I would love to see that improvement, but there is a lot of great articles and metrics in recent years indicating that the absolute worst shot in basketball is the midrange jumper because the risk/reward is insufficient. The most efficient offense would include great 3-point shooters, slashers who can get to and finish at the rim, and big men who can rebound and finish in the paint. Dawyne Evans, Mike McCall, Rob Loe, and Jordair Jet were all ideal in an efficient offense because they all brought one or more of these strengths. I would like to see our returning guards work on the strength and explosiveness to get to the rim and finish their drives. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basketbill Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 David I would agree with you, but there is a place for it in one's arsenal. I would love to see MB master a tear drop drive, and add that to his 3pt shot. When we face a shot blocker, we have not had an August type player (ND) to finish the play after our guards shot is blocked. Having the ability to shoot a pull-up 10 footer, or get the tear drop off before the defense is ready for it will help in those situations, and it helps generate better opportunities to finish at the rim. Recall Dwayne against NM St. He kept hitting the 12 footer over the 7-6 dude until he could drive around him. Jett was not just strong and a finisher, he had a pull-up shot too. You are correct though a two point shot that you cannot make 50 percent of the time is the worst shot in basketball. I hate the 18 foot jumper.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soderball Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 David I would agree with you, but there is a place for it in one arsenal. When we face a shot blocker, we have not had an August type player (ND) to finish the play after our guards shot is blocked. Being able to hit the 10 ft shot helps generate opportunities to finish at the rim. Recall Dwayne against NM St. He kept hitting the 12 footer over the 7-6 dude until he could drive around him. Jett was not just strong and a finisher, he had a pull-up shot too. You are correct though a two point shot that you cannot make 50 percent of the time is the worst shot in basketball. I hate the 18 foot jumper.... That ogre at NM St was terrible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3star_recruit Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 I agree that I would love to see that improvement, but there is a lot of great articles and metrics in recent years indicating that the absolute worst shot in basketball is the midrange jumper because the risk/reward is insufficient. The most efficient offense would include great 3-point shooters, slashers who can get to and finish at the rim, and big men who can rebound and finish in the paint. Dawyne Evans, Mike McCall, Rob Loe, and Jordair Jet were all ideal in an efficient offense because they all brought one or more of these strengths. I would like to see our returning guards work on the strength and explosiveness to get to the rim and finish their drives. When you get run off the three point line and big guys collapse in the paint, you still have to be able to score. It's just part of a good offensive player's arsernal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hsmith19 Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 Has there ever been a SLU roster before with everyone listed at 6'1" or taller? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dwayne's_World Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 I'd settle for 8-10 lb of muscle and a midrange game. Good point, I don't know if any of our players ever took effective jump shots off the dribble during games. Probably why defenses always seemed to effectively collapse on our guards' drives. Another thing I have noticed good teams doing in the Tourney is pump faking shots to make their man jump, and then side stepping that to take a shot. None of our players did that either, though it's probably something easier said than done.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheeseman Posted April 1, 2015 Share Posted April 1, 2015 At this point, I think this is the best fit/player we are going to get. I am not sure what he "lacks" that made the big boys shy away (just looking at his offers)...my guess is he lacks the explosive nature (read dunking ability) expected from the high majors. That doesn't really bother me at all. Right now, I just want someone who can stay in front of his man, doesnt dribble right into the double-team, and knows how to use a screen. Roby and Yarbrough can bring the explosiveness. Spring recruiting seems to always be a challenge for SLU and this is a welcome addition. If he ends up playing major minutes this year, then that would be a true testament to his talent and fit. MR and MB are all presumably working on their games to ensure that they are the PG next year. The over/under just went to 18.5 wins next season Jett was a spring recruit so was Loe and Ellis if memory serves me right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheeseman Posted April 1, 2015 Share Posted April 1, 2015 I'd settle for 8-10 lb of muscle and a midrange game. I agree - 15-20 pounds is asking a bit much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clock_Tower Posted April 1, 2015 Share Posted April 1, 2015 Jett was a spring recruit so was Loe and Ellis if memory serves me right. I believe RM badly wanted Jett but he needed to go to prep school before coming to SLU. Does this sound right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidnark Posted April 1, 2015 Share Posted April 1, 2015 When you get run off the three point line and big guys collapse in the paint, you still have to be able to score. It's just part of a good offensive player's arsernal. I agree that you need a midrange game to open up other pieces, but it still should be off of penetration and should consist of 10' - 15' jumpers ala Jett. Any shot from 15' - 20' is a bad one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kmbilliken Posted April 1, 2015 Share Posted April 1, 2015 If Miles and Bartley work extremely hard in the offseason to add about 15-20 lbs of muscle (which is not hard for guys that are already skinny), then they will be much more effective at driving on their man into the paint. That factor alone will cause drastic improvements to our offense, considering that neither seemed capable last season of doing anything more than drawing a foul or getting the ball swatted away when driving. Most guys aren't skinny because they haven't tried to put on weight. They're skinny because they have a hard time putting on weight. Putting on 15 to 20 pounders will be difficult for Bartley. Miles looks like he will have an easier time because he looks like he can "muscle up". Bartley doesn't appear to have that body type. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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