Quality Is Job 1 Posted December 30, 2015 Share Posted December 30, 2015 Folks need to keep in mind that Roy is always a Metro East proponent. Players and teams from Missouri automatically get downgraded. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted December 30, 2015 Share Posted December 30, 2015 Thicks you need to see althoff play before you make replies like that. I've seen all three of these players play. You obviously haven't Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLUfan_42 Posted December 30, 2015 Share Posted December 30, 2015 Thicks you need to see althoff play before you make replies like that. I've seen all three of these players play. You obviously haven't Althoff is loaded. Offer Marvin Bateman while we still can since we missed out on Ferguson, Gooch, and most likely Goodwin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted December 30, 2015 Share Posted December 30, 2015 Althoff is loaded. Offer Marvin Bateman while we still can since we missed out on Ferguson, Gooch, and most likely Goodwin. Totally agree. Bateman as good if not better shooter than moore. Plus he's been playing on winning teams. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pistol Posted December 30, 2015 Share Posted December 30, 2015 I didn't watch the game, but Zeke Moore had a much better showing this afternoon against Fort Zumwalt North scoring 31 points on 12-22 shooting (7-15 from 3) and grabbed 10 rebounds. He apparently only scored 14 in the evening game against Belleville East in a 68-50 loss. I know a doubleheader is a tall order, but that's a bit of a letdown after the strong morning performance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quality Is Job 1 Posted December 30, 2015 Share Posted December 30, 2015 Thicks you need to see althoff play before you make replies like that. I've seen all three of these players play. You obviously haven't I was speaking generally, not specifically about this one day. I was just letting newer posters know you have a rather significant Illinois-side bias so they can add a grain of salt to your analysis of Missouri-side teams and players. That's all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billiken_roy Posted December 30, 2015 Share Posted December 30, 2015 I was speaking generally, not specifically about this one day. I was just letting newer posters know you have a rather significant Illinois-side bias so they can add a grain of salt to your analysis of Missouri-side teams and players. That's all. i's not a bias as much as it is a matter of those are the players i have seen play. i am not going to comment on players i havent seen with my own eyes. thus most of the recruiting information i bring up are indeed east side players. but when i see maybe the best area high school player ever (tatum) from st louis with my own eyes i indeed told the board he was that good. when i see zeke moore play both last year and this year and see a very good fundamentally sound shooter but nothing special beyond that i tell the board. i've seen this althoff team at least 25 times and they are special probably headed back to the state championship game again at year end. we should have been all over their big four players and yes they are all as good or better than zeke. zeke would be a nice addition to a team loaded with talent and add him as a wing sniper. unfortunately we need a king on this team. and i shudder to think how wrong it would be to expect moore to fill that goto man role. he is not that player. not saying he cant be successful at slu. again he is an excellent shooter. but he lacks the mindset, discipline and know how at this point in his basketball career in my eyes. and stepping into this roster is not going to likely lead to success imo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billboy1 Posted December 30, 2015 Share Posted December 30, 2015 It's fantasy land to talk about making offers-who would want to walk into this mess. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soderball Posted December 30, 2015 Share Posted December 30, 2015 It's fantasy land to talk about making offers-who would want to walk into this mess. It's probably hyperbole, but I tend to agree with this sentiment. This is not exactly the best place to develop basketball skills and showcase talents.. I have to question anyone who would be willing to jump on board the Crews dumpster fire. I'm glad to hear Zeke can shoot, but let's be honest: we need athletes and ball protectors, we have enough guys who huck up threes all night long. I often disagree with Roy, but his analysis is on point: we don't need another wing sniper or role player --- we need a Marquee Perry or Kwamain Mitchell. I doubt Crews can land us someone who can transform the team like that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheChosenOne Posted December 30, 2015 Share Posted December 30, 2015 He apparently only scored 14 in the evening game against Belleville East in a 68-50 loss. I know a doubleheader is a tall order, but that's a bit of a letdown after the strong morning performance. Based on the box score Zeke was 5-12 from the field (1-4 from 3 and 3-4 from the line) for 14 points and had 7 rebounds. Javon Pickett for Belleville East was 9-18 from the field (1-2 from 3 and 6-7 from the line) for 25 points and grabbed 18 rebounds (he also had 3 assists and 2 steals). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheA_Bomb Posted December 30, 2015 Share Posted December 30, 2015 It's probably hyperbole, but I tend to agree with this sentiment. This is not exactly the best place to develop basketball skills and showcase talents.. I have to question anyone who would be willing to jump on board the Crews dumpster fire. I'm glad to hear Zeke can shoot, but let's be honest: we need athletes and ball protectors, we have enough guys who huck up threes all night long. I often disagree with Roy, but his analysis is on point: we don't need another wing sniper or role player --- we need a Marquee Perry or Kwamain Mitchell. I doubt Crews can land us someone who can transform the team like that. ^^^^^This above is First Rate Analysis^^^^^^ Seriously we should just always recruit guys that will be among the best players SLU has ever had. Why hasn't anyone thought of that before? It's like this guy is the John Madden of College Basketball Recruiting Analysis. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soderball Posted December 30, 2015 Share Posted December 30, 2015 ^^^^^This above is First Rate Analysis^^^^^^ Seriously we should just always recruit guys that will be among the best players SLU has ever had. Why hasn't anyone thought of that before? It's like this guy is the John Madden of College Basketball Recruiting Analysis. Even soderberg gave us more talented players than crews. You are delusional. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheA_Bomb Posted December 30, 2015 Share Posted December 30, 2015 Even soderberg gave us more talented players than crews. You are delusional. I'm delusional about what? I'm praising your amazing analysis. I've made no value statements on the level of recruiting of Soderberg or Crews in the most recent posts. I only posted in awe of the college basketball recruiting knowledge that you shared with the world. Inspiring stuff and I really had an epiphany. Recruit guys that will make the SLU all-time great lists, simple, elegant and a can't miss strategy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soderball Posted December 30, 2015 Share Posted December 30, 2015 I'm delusional about what? I'm praising your amazing analysis. I've made no value statements on the level of recruiting of Soderberg or Crews in the most recent posts. I only posted in awe of the college basketball recruiting knowledge that you shared with the world. Inspiring stuff and I really had an epiphany. Recruit guys that will make the SLU all-time great lists, simple, elegant and a can't miss strategy. What i am trying to say is that we need a dude who can step up and make plays for us. Tommie Liddell, Justin Love, whoever. Who on this team is anywhere close to that playmaking ability? I am not saying we need NBA hero Anthony Bonner or The Legend. We need a damn playmaker. That Crews doesnt have one is concerning. I dont get the need for the sarcasm. Where does this team go in crunch time? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slufanskip Posted December 30, 2015 Share Posted December 30, 2015 What i am trying to say is that we need a dude who can step up and make plays for us. Tommie Liddell, Justin Love, whoever. Who on this team is anywhere close to that playmaking ability? I am not saying we need NBA hero Anthony Bonner or The Legend. We need a damn playmaker. That Crews doesnt have one is concerning. I dont get the need for the sarcasm. Where does this team go in crunch time? so we don't recruit anyone that doesn't fit that bill? I for one haven't seen Zeke play but if he shoots as advertised, I'll take him, especially with his length. It's not like we are constantly overwhelmed with great or even good shooters. Will he learn the intangibles and other skills and become a good or dare I say great player for SLU? Who knows. Maybe he just ends up a role player. We'll see, but I'll take my chance starting with a great shooter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soderball Posted December 30, 2015 Share Posted December 30, 2015 so we don't recruit anyone that doesn't fit that bill? I for one haven't seen Zeke play but if he shoots as advertised, I'll take him, especially with his length. It's not like we are constantly overwhelmed with great or even good shooters. Will he learn the intangibles and other skills and become a good or dare I say great player for SLU? Who knows. Maybe he just ends up a role player. We'll see, but I'll take my chance starting with a great shooter I prefer points and athleticism over "intangibles." Did I state that I don't like Zeke? I've never seen him play and often high school numbers and skills dont translate well to the higher level anyway. If Zeke hits like a maniac he will be a difference maker, but without a playmaking player. Zeke will get brutalized by hulking A10 forwards on this current roster and his shot will not be at full potency. We have Milik moving the ball up the floor for crying out loud. I just dont think zeke is what we need right now without serious roster purging. He is hopefully less of a project and more of a shooter. We need him shooting well his freshman year. I have no doubts zeke could start with this current cast. Crews failed to deliver a playmaker and instead loaded us with "projects" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#firecrews Posted December 30, 2015 Share Posted December 30, 2015 After watching Zeke play several times I'm not impressed. He can shoot the three. But other than that I start to worry. First of all the kid looks like he weighs 142lbs up close. I fear he will get man handled by guards with any substantial strength. And you can kiss any penetration goodbye with that frame. He may be able to create against the 14-18 yr olds he is playing now. But the kid needs to eat, then eat again unless he wants to get used to settling for 3's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slufanskip Posted December 30, 2015 Share Posted December 30, 2015 I prefer points and athleticism over "intangibles." Did I state that I don't like Zeke? I've never seen him play and often high school numbers and skills dont translate well to the higher level anyway. If Zeke hits like a maniac he will be a difference maker, but without a playmaking player. Zeke will get brutalized by hulking A10 forwards on this current roster and his shot will not be at full potency. We have Milik moving the ball up the floor for crying out loud. I just dont think zeke is what we need right now without serious roster purging. He is hopefully less of a project and more of a shooter. We need him shooting well his freshman year. I have no doubts zeke could start with this current cast. Crews failed to deliver a playmaker and instead loaded us with "projects" Every player is a project to some extent. We could have a great ball handler that can't finish at the rim or shoot which negates his ball handling skills ... I agree we need a pg who can control and assert his will on a game ... They are hard to find and Crews doesn't seem to be able to find one. I actually believe Crews brought in good players, he just can't seem to develop them. Evans, Jett, McCall all had flaws as frosh and I'm not sure they were any better coming in than our current soph class. They just had a great teacher to help them become great players. This class doesn't seem to have that. How much better would the soph class be if RM was their coach? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soderball Posted December 30, 2015 Share Posted December 30, 2015 Every player is a project to some extent. We could have a great ball handler that can't finish at the rim or shoot which negates his ball handling skills ... I agree we need a pg who can control and assert his will on a game ... They are hard to find and Crews doesn't seem to be able to find one. I actually believe Crews brought in good players, he just can't seem to develop them. Evans, Jett, McCall all had flaws as frosh and I'm not sure they were any better coming in than our current soph class. They just had a great teacher to help them become great players. This class doesn't seem to have that. How much better would the soph class be if RM was their coach? A very valid question. One i have tried to think about. Ultimately its an unknown. We just dont know. It is hard to find those players but teams have to find them, like it or not. Its the most important thing to have in the modern college game, I think. Far more important than h as ving a traditional center, which we seem to be going through a ton of scholarships to find. Why dont we just recruit more quick guards instead of tall slow dudes. Being tall and weak is a huge liability, as evans, conklin, and jett proved time and time again. We are tall and relatively weak. I agree that we have some players who can ball. We could be competitive in short order if we landed a glaze-esque inside scrapper to help us board and a quock PG. Even dwayne polk would help us, im so desperate that i truly believe that. The wings we have can serve to get us back off the bottom and have some close losses instead of incredible beatdowns like we are getting. I like miles and davell. Those dudes can actually ball. Crawford is workable. Bishop is still just a baby. I have no idea what he can or cant do. Will help to get the mask off of him. Welmer can be good if he shoots accurately. We miss strength and ball handling, though. Those could be argued to ne the most important aspects of the game. Cannot play good defense when weak. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slufanskip Posted December 30, 2015 Share Posted December 30, 2015 A very valid question. One i have tried to think about. Ultimately its an unknown. We just dont know. It is hard to find those players but teams have to find them, like it or not. Its the most important thing to have in the modern college game, I think. Far more important than h as ving a traditional center, which we seem to be going through a ton of scholarships to find. Why dont we just recruit more quick guards instead of tall slow dudes. Being tall and weak is a huge liability, as evans, conklin, and jett proved time and time again. We are tall and relatively weak. I agree that we have some players who can ball. We could be competitive in short order if we landed a glaze-esque inside scrapper to help us board and a quock PG. Even dwayne polk would help us, im so desperate that i truly believe that. The wings we have can serve to get us back off the bottom and have some close losses instead of incredible beatdowns like we are getting. I like miles and davell. Those dudes can actually ball. Crawford is workable. Bishop is still just a baby. I have no idea what he can or cant do. Will help to get the mask off of him. Welmer can be good if he shoots accurately. We miss strength and ball handling, though. Those could be argued to ne the most important aspects of the game. Cannot play good defense when weak. Agree but I just think how good Milik would be with RM. He'd be very good or gone. Either he'd have started to get it last year or RM would have run him off. You are a rather new poster, most old posters know my thoughts on a pg. Probably the most important position on the court. However, RM was able to make us good with guys playing the pg who were more combo guards as the ability to run his offense to perfection created opportunities more so than a pg. I think we have quite a few players that were as good coming in as most RM recruits. The difference was by mid soph year RM's recruits were learning and making improvements. These guys are still basically the same player they were 40 games and 14 months ago Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cgeldmacher Posted December 30, 2015 Share Posted December 30, 2015 I feel bad for Zeke. Our program did a 180 from our success of a few years ago and the fan base has nothing to be excited about with the current team. So, we are now grasping for any signs of hope. We have only one recruit currently on the books. Now, this high school kid has to have everything about his game over analyzed. If we want to let out our frustrations, let's complain about those that currently make up the team. Leave this kid alone at least until he gets here. That is assuming he doesn't decide to change his mind and go elsewhere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheChosenOne Posted December 30, 2015 Share Posted December 30, 2015 If we want to let out our frustrations, let's complain about those that currently make up the team. Leave this kid alone at least until he gets here. That is assuming he doesn't decide to change his mind and go elsewhere. Don't contribute to the discussion then. The thread is about Zeke Moore with those who have seen him play giving their evaluations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willie Posted December 30, 2015 Share Posted December 30, 2015 Unlike a lot of people on this board I think there is some talent on our team but we just play bad dumb basketball. I agree with Skip a Milik would stop making the same dumb play or he would be gone. Obviously this all falls on the coaches who either recruited bad players or can't teach how to play the game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbizzle09 Posted December 30, 2015 Share Posted December 30, 2015 Unlike a lot of people on this board I think there is some talent on our team but we just play bad dumb basketball. I agree with Skip a Milik would stop making the same dumb play or he would be gone. Obviously this all falls on the coaches who either recruited bad players or can't teach how to play the game. Agreed. I've felt all along that there is real talent with many of these players. A surplus? No. But you have a core that an actual coach could build around and extract a decent record from if he, y'know, actually could do the job a coach is supposed to do. I'm not sure RM teams were head and shoulders more talented than this group. (More talented? Yes. Just not supremely so.) If Majerus had this crew, he would have likely ran a couple of them off, but also gotten major improvement from those he kept. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slufanskip Posted December 30, 2015 Share Posted December 30, 2015 One problem with comparing RM's recruits is our judgement is clouded with the player they became and it's very hard to remember the player they were the day they 1st stepped on the floor their frosh year. How many games would the class of Jett, Evans, Loe, and McCall have won had Crews been their coach from day 1? I'd say without a KM and an Ellis ahead of them they'd have been lucky to win 10 as sophs as with JC as their coach they'd still be the same player they were as freshman. I'd love to have gotten the chance to see Milik, Bartley, and Roby develop under RM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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