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VCU joining in 2013 - CBSSPORTS reports


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VCU won 5 NCAA tourney games before Shaka's run.

Virginia Commonwealth's last NCAA Tournament win before the Shaka Smart era was in 2007 against Duke.

Draw your own conclusions.

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Virginia Commonwealth's last NCAA Tournament win before the Shaka Smart era was in 2007 against Duke. Draw your own conclusions.

those sob's. no doubt cheated to win a game like that. i dont want em now either.

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This whole adding Butler business is ridiculous. Get us Indiana and Purdue instead. Replace Bonaventure with Syracuse. Boot Dayton in favor of Ohio State. Come on, guys. It's so simple, maybe you need a refresher course.

Ohio State has more tourney wins than Dayton. Indiana has more national championships than Butler. Syracuse is better than St. Bonaventure.

I'm just stating facts.

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and MB you still havent told us what schools would have been better alternatives.

I never said I would tell you. You asked, yes.

I just said that VCU and Butler are overrated, I am not ga-ga over them like some of you.

Both teams are on a roll, some attributable to their outstanding coach, and some random luck with some players that panned out (Butler). I say they will fall back to the pack when they lose their current superstar coach and get into a stronger conference (A-10 = # 7, vs # 14 & # 15).

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I never said I would tell you. You asked, yes.

I just said that VCU and Butler are overrated, I am not ga-ga over them like some of you.

Both teams are on a roll, some attributable to their outstanding coach, and some random luck with some players that panned out (Butler). I say they will fall back to the pack when they lose their current superstar coach and get into a stronger conference (A-10 = # 7, vs # 14 & # 15).

OK, so what would mb have done? you didnt want butler or vcu, what would you have done if you were the all powerful A-10/billikens benefactor god when temple and charlotte gave notice? we just want to understand where you are coming from that could possibly explain why you are not ga ga over butler and vcu. from the majority of our viewpoints, we cannot see a better alternative, so please tell us what should have happened instead.

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OK, so what would mb have done? you didnt want butler or vcu, what would you have done if you were the all powerful A-10/billikens benefactor god when temple and charlotte gave notice? we just want to understand where you are coming from that could possibly explain why you are not ga ga over butler and vcu. from the majority of our viewpoints, we cannot see a better alternative, so please tell us what should have happened instead.

MVC

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OK, so what would mb have done? you didnt want butler or vcu, what would you have done if you were the all powerful A-10/billikens benefactor god when temple and charlotte gave notice? we just want to understand where you are coming from that could possibly explain why you are not ga ga over butler and vcu. from the majority of our viewpoints, we cannot see a better alternative, so please tell us what should have happened instead.

Broy, you are slipping.

I said in a previous post that Butler and VCU are OK, but that I am not so thrilled and excited about them, they are overrated, come from weak conferences, and they are not an upgrade over Temple and Charlotte combined.

You said Butler and VCU are an upgrade. Fine.

I say, A-10 conference = allowance horses, Horizon and Colonial are claimers.

I offered no better solutions, it would be a joke to go through that exercise, what two teams would be better, realistically. Should I say Creighton then all the loons will pile on about the MVC (.0066 lower RPI than A-10) and Duke and soccer.

So, the answer is, fine, VCU and Butler, but that they are overrated, achieved some great things recently (deep into the tourney) but probably will be has-beens when the two coaches leave and they play in the A-10.

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Broy, you are slipping.

I said in a previous post that Butler and VCU are OK, but that I am not so thrilled and excited about them, they are overrated, come from weak conferences, and they are not an upgrade over Temple and Charlotte combined.

You said Butler and VCU are an upgrade. Fine.

I say, A-10 conference = allowance horses, Horizon and Colonial are claimers.

I offered no better solutions, it would be a joke to go through that exercise, what two teams would be better, realistically. Should I say Creighton then all the loons will pile on about the MVC (.0066 lower RPI than A-10) and Duke and soccer.

So, the answer is, fine, VCU and Butler, but that they are overrated, achieved some great things recently (deep into the tourney) but probably will be has-beens when the two coaches leave and they play in the A-10.

Listen, kid, I think everyone would agree with you about adding Creighton and I suspect a fair amount of them would want Creighton over VCU.

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How many MVC teams have made the final four recently?

Also, I'm guessing the MVC and CAA/Horizon have been pretty close in RPI, yet the top teams from the CAA/Horizon are overrated.

I think the way to show MB why the combo of Butler and VCU is an upgrade to Temple and Charlotte is to use comparitive RPIs and show the difference (especially since he loves RPI so much!) Since 2001, here are the average RPI rankings of these teams:

Butler - 64

VCU - 70

Temple - 63

Charlotte - 106

So, over the past 12 seasons, the combined average RPI rankings of Temple and Butler are nearly identical, while VCU's is 36 places better than Charlotte's. And mind you, this isn't just over the past couple of seasons, but for the past 12. (SLU's over that period of time is 110, in case you wanted to know.) Let's also look at NCAA tourney wins in that same period of time, as that will show how these teams have fared on the biggest stage:

Butler - 16

VCU - 7

Temple - 4

Charlotte - 1

So, over the past 12 seasons, VCU and Butler have combined for 23 NCAA tourney wins, while Temple and Charlotte have combined for 5. That is a pretty large disparity, no matter how you dice it, and regardless of what glamour boy is coach at the time.

Ever since these moves have started being dicussed, and especially as they have come to fruition, it appears that the opinion has been that Temple for Butler is pretty much a wash and VCU for Charlotte is a win for the A-10. Combined, it would appear that the A-10 is getting stronger with these moves, not staying at the same strength or possibly even getting weaker. Considering the sustained success that both VCU and Butler have had through various coaching regimes, and their ability to face-off and beat competition from the power conferences over the years, I just don't see how anyone can see this as a YAWN.

But, you know, some people like nothing more than to piss in other people's Cheerios.

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I think the way to show MB why the combo of Butler and VCU is an upgrade to Temple and Charlotte is to use comparitive RPIs and show the difference (especially since he loves RPI so much!) Since 2001, here are the average RPI rankings of these teams: Butler - 64 VCU - 70 Temple - 63 Charlotte - 106 So, over the past 12 seasons, the combined average RPI rankings of Temple and Butler are nearly identical, while VCU's is 36 places better than Charlotte's. And mind you, this isn't just over the past couple of seasons, but for the past 12. (SLU's over that period of time is 110, in case you wanted to know.) Let's also look at NCAA tourney wins in that same period of time, as that will show how these teams have fared on the biggest stage: Butler - 16 VCU - 7 Temple - 4 Charlotte - 1 So, over the past 12 seasons, VCU and Butler have combined for 23 NCAA tourney wins, while Temple and Charlotte have combined for 5. That is a pretty large disparity, no matter how you dice it, and regardless of what glamour boy is coach at the time. Ever since these moves have started being dicussed, and especially as they have come to fruition, it appears that the opinion has been that Temple for Butler is pretty much a wash and VCU for Charlotte is a win for the A-10. Combined, it would appear that the A-10 is getting stronger with these moves, not staying at the same strength or possibly even getting weaker. Considering the sustained success that both VCU and Butler have had through various coaching regimes, and their ability to face-off and beat competition from the power conferences over the years, I just don't see how anyone can see this as a YAWN. But, you know, some people like nothing more than to piss in other people's Cheerios.

-bizzle, kid, when will you learn facts are not reality with some people??? :blink:

-good stuff

-since tourney appearances are not important i would guess tourney wins are also not important

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I think the way to show MB why the combo of Butler and VCU is an upgrade to Temple and Charlotte is to use comparitive RPIs and show the difference (especially since he loves RPI so much!) Since 2001, here are the average RPI rankings of these teams:

Butler - 64

VCU - 70

Temple - 63

Charlotte - 106

So, over the past 12 seasons, the combined average RPI rankings of Temple and Butler are nearly identical, while VCU's is 36 places better than Charlotte's. And mind you, this isn't just over the past couple of seasons, but for the past 12. (SLU's over that period of time is 110, in case you wanted to know.) Let's also look at NCAA tourney wins in that same period of time, as that will show how these teams have fared on the biggest stage:

Butler - 16

VCU - 7

Temple - 4

Charlotte - 1

So, over the past 12 seasons, VCU and Butler have combined for 23 NCAA tourney wins, while Temple and Charlotte have combined for 5. That is a pretty large disparity, no matter how you dice it, and regardless of what glamour boy is coach at the time.

Ever since these moves have started being dicussed, and especially as they have come to fruition, it appears that the opinion has been that Temple for Butler is pretty much a wash and VCU for Charlotte is a win for the A-10. Combined, it would appear that the A-10 is getting stronger with these moves, not staying at the same strength or possibly even getting weaker. Considering the sustained success that both VCU and Butler have had through various coaching regimes, and their ability to face-off and beat competition from the power conferences over the years, I just don't see how anyone can see this as a YAWN.

But, you know, some people like nothing more than to piss in other people's Cheerios.

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I think the way to show MB why the combo of Butler and VCU is an upgrade to Temple and Charlotte is to use comparitive RPIs and show the difference (especially since he loves RPI so much!) Since 2001, here are the average RPI rankings of these teams:

Butler - 64

VCU - 70

Temple - 63

Charlotte - 106

So, over the past 12 seasons, the combined average RPI rankings of Temple and Butler are nearly identical, while VCU's is 36 places better than Charlotte's. And mind you, this isn't just over the past couple of seasons, but for the past 12. (SLU's over that period of time is 110, in case you wanted to know.) Let's also look at NCAA tourney wins in that same period of time, as that will show how these teams have fared on the biggest stage:

Butler - 16

VCU - 7

Temple - 4

Charlotte - 1

So, over the past 12 seasons, VCU and Butler have combined for 23 NCAA tourney wins, while Temple and Charlotte have combined for 5. That is a pretty large disparity, no matter how you dice it, and regardless of what glamour boy is coach at the time.

Ever since these moves have started being dicussed, and especially as they have come to fruition, it appears that the opinion has been that Temple for Butler is pretty much a wash and VCU for Charlotte is a win for the A-10. Combined, it would appear that the A-10 is getting stronger with these moves, not staying at the same strength or possibly even getting weaker. Considering the sustained success that both VCU and Butler have had through various coaching regimes, and their ability to face-off and beat competition from the power conferences over the years, I just don't see how anyone can see this as a YAWN.

But, you know, some people like nothing more than to piss in other people's Cheerios.

This coming from a man who said Pujols (.214) will continure to hit .329 until 2021 and is worth $ 254M. I told you he is 3+ yrs older than the 32 he claims, and is pratically "shot"... another 2-3 yrs, best case, sliding fast.

Mark my words, when Butler and VCU lose their coaches, 1-2 yrs later they will be mediocre programs, middle of the pack in the A-10. Butler was fortunate with Heyward and that guard (?) and some others that exceeded expectations, and is already starting to slide, RPI 116 this yr, recruits know coach will move on as soon as his dream job is open ('Cuse? Duke? NC?).

Good stats, bizzle, I realized that Charlotte is the weak link but Temple is proven in a tougher conferernce and has a deep tradition. I am saying that Charlotte is OK and the stats will be irrelevant since Butler and VCU will sink after their recent runs and their coaches get the jobs they want elsewhere. Yes, Butler-VCU are adequate replacements, about as good as can be hoped. I just am not so excited as many are on this board.

Maybe one will get past this, some do, I cited Xavier as an exception, and Gonzaga, a few others, some Universities have a strong committment from their President. But mostly, the mid major conference teams (Pistol) flop after they have a good run with a great coach who leaves.

Many posters had observed that Butler benefited greatly from the Horizon environment, but bizzle waits for me to comment, then unleases 100 hours of research and a 5,000 word mush of statistics that are mostly irrelevant. Jealous loon. Get a life. It is not that big a deal. I cannot understand all of the ruckus.

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-so someone's opinion or projection on one item maybe wrong (jury still out as pujols has a lot of at bats remaining this season (but i am not saying he will reach his career avgs)) so they can't be right about anything esle? if that is the case everyone on this board should have everyone else on ignore

-mb, kid, what you are projecting is a different outcome for vcu and butler when their coaches leave than what has happened to their programs when replacing previous coaches (which led them to hiring shaka and stevens) as these schools have had success under multiple coaches, why is this going to change?

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