VCU over the Bills by 1

[billiken_roy]

15 minutes ago, teamarete said:

The old temple teams only went 6-7 deep.  Besides, many teams play zone because it isn't as physically taxing nor do you see foul trouble as much.

so you are saying that our 4-7 players are as good as chaney's good teams 4-7 players?   just my opinion, but i dont see the likes of hines playing for temple ever. 

[teamarete]

23 minutes ago, billiken_roy said:

so you are saying that our 4-7 players are as good as chaney's good teams 4-7 players?   just my opinion, but i dont see the likes of hines playing for temple ever. 

Not saying that...was saying what the benefits of a zone are.  Hines' issue is more on the offensive end, he does a solid job in their zone.

[TFord and TRavs]

Our power ranking is complete BS 

[TheOne]

This is a big game for our reputation, our fan base, and our players.  VCU is considered an A10 heavyweight.  In the Majerus era, this team coming to town would pack Chaifetz for games that were typically picked up by big time networks like CBS and ESPN - this was THE matchup in our conference.  This is an opportunity for the players to come together to beat a big name team on national television and make a statement to the administration that SLU can again compete on a national level.

[billiken_roy]

8 minutes ago, teamarete said:

Not saying that...was saying what the benefits of a zone are.  Hines' issue is more on the offensive end, he does a solid job in their zone.

i dont want to be specific beyond the fact hines isnt good enough to have ever even got a uniform for syracuse and temple back in the day.   likely anthony and johnson are not either.   and i doubt beyond a matured upper classman goodwin or french any of our other players are either.   again the point is, the fact syracuse and temple succeeded playing zone defenses and being able to rebound effectively had more to do with their talent level than  anything else.  

[teamarete]

3 minutes ago, billiken_roy said:

i dont want to be specific beyond the fact hines isnt good enough to have ever even got a uniform for syracuse and temple back in the day.   likely anthony and johnson are not either.   and i doubt beyond a matured upper classman goodwin or french any of our other players are either.   again the point is, the fact syracuse and temple succeeded playing zone defenses and being able to rebound effectively had more to do with their talent level than  anything else.  

I was just arguing the merits of playing a zone, lack of talent and depth are usually up there.  Obviously Ford agrees which is why we've seen longer stretches of zone this year.

[HoosierPal]

Interesting that French is the only regular that has not lead the team in scoring for a game.  Roby and Bess each have lead the team in scoring 5 games, Goodwin 4, and Foreman, Hines and Johnson each 2 games apiece.  Stop one player, another picks up the slack.

[The Wiz]

A tough loss ...after leading nearly the whole game....this one slipped away. So many chances to win ...an extra FT or a 3 or even a different bounce......not to mention VCU down 3 in the final sec of reg and they hit a 3.....on that shot SLU has a 2/3 chance of winning the game.....,.but that is the way OT games go...just 1 thing different.

Let's look at the bottom line from the original post.....

Hold VCU to 70 pts.....fail

Stop Tillman at 14pts and 7 reb....Actual 25 pts and 12 reb....Double fail.

Slash 45 /35 /72....Actual 40/ 19 / 72....the fail here is 3 missed 3's ...with 3 more 3's  the slash is on target with a 45  /38/ 72 and we win by 8. Of course even if they make only 1 more 3 and shoot a miserable 25% we win...The point is you can't shoot less than 20% and win.

TOs....Double fail....18 is way to many and 7 extra is almost always a loss....gave up 14 extra points...an easy win turns into a narrow loss.

Rebs....48-31 we dominated and this is what kept us in the game...an amazing stat

So close but no cigar....some serious fails yet amazing rebounding kept us within 1.... 1 more pt ...1 more reb...1 more FT... 1 less TO...1 more bounce...1 more player (depth)

A young inexperienced  team loses  games like these and learns and wins next time.

Good game ...good effort...learn and win

 

[TheOne]

8 hours ago, The Wiz said:

A tough loss ...after leading nearly the whole game....this one slipped away. So many chances to win ...an extra FT or a 3 or even a different bounce......not to mention VCU down 3 in the final sec of reg and they hit a 3.....on that shot SLU has a 2/3 chance of winning the game.....,.but that is the way OT games go...just 1 thing different.

Let's look at the bottom line from the original post.....

Hold VCU to 70 pts.....fail

Stop Tillman at 14pts and 7 reb....Actual 25 pts and 12 reb....Double fail.

Slash 45 /35 /72....Actual 40/ 19 / 72....the fail here is 3 missed 3's ...with 3 more 3's  the slash is on target with a 45  /38/ 72 and we win by 8. Of course even if they make only 1 more 3 and shoot a miserable 25% we win...The point is you can't shoot less than 20% and win.

TOs....Double fail....18 is way to many and 7 extra is almost always a loss....gave up 14 extra points...an easy win turns into a narrow loss.

Rebs....48-31 we dominated and this is what kept us in the game...an amazing stat

So close but no cigar....some serious fails yet amazing rebounding kept us within 1.... 1 more pt ...1 more reb...1 more FT... 1 less TO...1 more bounce...1 more player (depth)

A young inexperienced  team loses  games like these and learns and wins next time.

Good game ...good effort...learn and win

 

Embarrassing question but I’m hoping others are wondering the same - what does the slash line mean?

[Littlebill]

12 minutes ago, TheOne said:

Embarrassing question but I’m hoping others are wondering the same - what does the slash line mean?

2P%/3P%/FT%

[Quality Is Job 1]

17 minutes ago, TheOne said:

Embarrassing question but I’m hoping others are wondering the same - what does the slash line mean?

 

6 minutes ago, Littlebill said:

2P%/3P%/FT%

Littlebill has it almost correct.  It's (overall) field goal percentage, three-point field goal percentage, and free-throw percentage.

[Littlebill]

23 minutes ago, Quality Is Job 1 said:

 

Littlebill has it almost correct.  It's (overall) field goal percentage, three-point field goal percentage, and free-throw percentage.

welp

[The Wiz]

9 hours ago, TheOne said:

Embarrassing question but I’m hoping others are wondering the same - what does the slash line mean?

Quality J1 is correct....Total FG%....3P%...FT%....That is why on the post game wrap up post when I mentioned if we got 3 more 3s we would have made the slash line. ...By boosting the 3P% it also boosts the overall FG% (the 1st number). And this is not just for this game but for the season....if we can boost our 3P% we can boost our whole line.  We had a stretch of about 6 games where we shot pretty well from the arc (36.4% or better)  Before that we were in the top 10 of worst shooting 3pt teams. While we have come up from F- we are still at an unacceptable grade of F.  If we can bring up the 3 pt grade not only will we get some additional pts but it will take the pressure off other parts of our game.

Thanks for asking the question,.... I just wrongly assume people know what I am talking about.

One last thing....when Majerus was out recruiting he used to talk about finding magical players..."180 players".....he took the 3 slash line numbers and added them together...if they equaled 180 or better he was interested in them.

[TheOne]

2 hours ago, The Wiz said:

Quality J1 is correct....Total FG%....3P%...FT%....That is why on the post game wrap up post when I mentioned if we got 3 more 3s we would have made the slash line. ...By boosting the 3P% it also boosts the overall FG% (the 1st number). And this is not just for this game but for the season....if we can boost our 3P% we can boost our whole line.  We had a stretch of about 6 games where we shot pretty well from the arc (36.4% or better)  Before that we were in the top 10 of worst shooting 3pt teams. While we have come up from F- we are still at an unacceptable grade of F.  If we can bring up the 3 pt grade not only will we get some additional pts but it will take the pressure off other parts of our game.

Thanks for asking the question,.... I just wrongly assume people know what I am talking about.

One last thing....when Majerus was out recruiting he used to talk about finding magical players..."180 players".....he took the 3 slash line numbers and added them together...if they equaled 180 or better he was interested in them.

Thanks for the detailed response - love the great insight from Majerus.

[The Wiz]

I have one last question concerning this game.....With 15 sec left in regulation SLU had a 3 pt lead and  Bess missed a free throw  ... VCU got the ball and with 4 sec left sank a 3 and tied the game.  After the FT miss wouldn't it had made sense for SLU to foul VCU at that point?....Even if they make 2 , the Bills have the ball and a 1 pt lead with only seconds left in the game.  

Just wondering

[juniorbill76]

7 hours ago, The Wiz said:

I have one last question concerning this game.....With 15 sec left in regulation SLU had a 3 pt lead and  Bess missed a free throw  ... VCU got the ball and with 4 sec left sank a 3 and tied the game.  After the FT miss wouldn't it had made sense for SLU to foul VCU at that point?....Even if they make 2 , the Bills have the ball and a 1 pt lead with only seconds left in the game.  

Just wondering

That’s discussed at length at the back end of the GDT and seems to be a popular opinion, Wiz.

[The Wiz]

1 hour ago, juniorbill76 said:

That’s discussed at length at the back end of the GDT and seems to be a popular opinion, Wiz.

Sorry , I missed that. 

My 2 cents on the subject is... they should have probably fouled VCU.  While it can be argued that the odds were still in our favor to win....Jenkins (the guy who took the shot was their best 3P shooter at 43.4%...which means we had a 56.6% chance to win....Fouling would have eaten up some time (the shot wasn't taken till 5 sec left)...Had we fouled when they were still setting up the 3  (say around 7 seconds) we probably would have won the game.  VCU planned to shoot around the 5 sec mark so they could get a 2nd chance to take a 3 if they missed the first one....another reason to foul around the  7 second mark. 

[wgstl]

19 minutes ago, The Wiz said:

Sorry , I missed that. 

My 2 cents on the subject is... they should have probably fouled VCU.  While it can be argued that the odds were still in our favor to win....Jenkins (the guy who took the shot was their best 3P shooter at 43.4%...which means we had a 56.6% chance to win....Fouling would have eaten up some time (the shot wasn't taken till 5 sec left)...Had we fouled when they were still setting up the 3  (say around 7 seconds) we probably would have won the game.  VCU planned to shoot around the 5 sec mark so they could get a 2nd chance to take a 3 if they missed the first one....another reason to foul around the  7 second mark. 

I do wonder if we didnt foul because the 2 players defending the pg bringing the ball up  and the shooter both had 4 fouls. 

[billiken_roy]

7 minutes ago, wgstl said:

I do wonder if we didnt foul because the 2 players defending the pg bringing the ball up  and the shooter both had 4 fouls. 

that should have been forseen by the coach and players and assignments switched accordingly.   there was no doubt if bess missed the one free throw we needed to foul to avoid the 3.

[wgstl]

3 minutes ago, billiken_roy said:

that should have been forseen by the coach and players and assignments switched accordingly.   there was no doubt if bess missed the one free throw we needed to foul to avoid the 3.

Im sure it was, but something may have gone south that screwed everything up, and ford may have told a player who doesnt have 4 to foul and they never did. 

[willie]

25 minutes ago, wgstl said:

Im sure it was, but something may have gone south that screwed everything up, and ford may have told a player who doesnt have 4 to foul and they never did. 

With 4 seconds left who cares if someone fouls out. 

[HoosierPal]

1 hour ago, The Wiz said:

Sorry , I missed that. 

My 2 cents on the subject is... they should have probably fouled VCU.  While it can be argued that the odds were still in our favor to win....Jenkins (the guy who took the shot was their best 3P shooter at 43.4%...which means we had a 56.6% chance to win....Fouling would have eaten up some time (the shot wasn't taken till 5 sec left)...Had we fouled when they were still setting up the 3  (say around 7 seconds) we probably would have won the game.  VCU planned to shoot around the 5 sec mark so they could get a 2nd chance to take a 3 if they missed the first one....another reason to foul around the  7 second mark. 

The other factor that to me was wrong is that we played our normal D on that last play.  Foreman and Roby and I think Bess were in the paint to start the sequence.  Hines and Goodwin were on the perimeter.  We should have had everyone out beyond the arc blanketing every three point shooter.  Give them a 2 pointer.  Don't let any shooter even think about getting a touch. Roby came out on the shooter, but a ball fake got him the open look.  It should have never come down to that.

And I agree, a foul was called for.  I'll gamble on the Bills grabbing the inevitable rebound on the second, missed FT.

[White Pelican]

8 minutes ago, willie said:

With 4 seconds left who cares if someone fouls out. 

Exactly. We ended up losing the damn game. Someone fouling out wouldn't have made the outcome any worse.

[almaman]

4 hours ago, juniorbill76 said:

That’s discussed at length at the back end of the GDT and seems to be a popular opinion, Wiz.

Been discussed since 3 point play started.