Off-season talk

[brianstl]

I still haven't seen a good explanation for who Bishop will take the minutes from if he is going to play as much as some think.  Which of the guys that can fill either a role of a guard or wing will be sitting while Bishop gets all these minutes? Goodwin, AD, Bess, Roby, Johnson?  

Do people really think Graves is going to be buried on the bench when he is eligible?  You think Ford is going to bury the transfer he want hard after even though he already had the likes of Goodwin, AD, Roby, Bess and Bishop on the roster for the following season.

[Old guy]

I do not wish to upset anyone but I think  it is time that roy and big bill fan start considering the merits of ignoring one another. 

[Glorydays2013]

http://mutigers.com/schedule.aspx?path=mbball&

 

Mizzou has an awful non conference. Could affect their bid to the tourney

[Franchise_08]

9 minutes ago, Glorydays2013 said:

http://mutigers.com/schedule.aspx?path=mbball&

 

Mizzou has an awful non conference. Could affect their bid to the tourney

Still don't care TRavs

[billikenbill]

16 hours ago, wgstl said:

Speaking of MP is he still on the team?  Do walk-ons not practice in the summers?

Seems like I recall a tweet with him being named the "win the week" winner early in the summer so I'm sure he's been practicing with the team.

[Pistol]

13 hours ago, Quality Is Job 1 said:

You still haven't resolved how, in your previous post, you list "JB" as equaling Javon Bess and then later say it equals Jermaine Bishop.  Confusion reigns.

Holy smokes, I don't know how I didn't notice this. I was too worried about AD vs. AH. I give up.

[slufan13]

10 minutes ago, Pistol said:

Holy smokes, I don't know how I didn't notice this. I was too worried about AD vs. AH. I give up.

I guess we didn't retire JB for Barnett? Maybe we need glorydays/tford to find out everyone's nicknames.

[Pistol]

17 minutes ago, slufan13 said:

I guess we didn't retire JB for Barnett? Maybe we need glorydays/tford to find out everyone's nicknames.

JB1 = Bess and JB2 = Bishop?

[billiken_roy]

the easiest solution is dont  use initials.  it's always been a confusing practice on this board.   

[MusicCityBilliken]

Who is AD? Went back to SLU Athletic website to check the roster and see no one with those initials.

Only AD I remember is Anthony Drejaj.

[Cowboy]

7 minutes ago, tarheelbilliken said:

Who is AD? Went back to SLU Athletic website to check the roster and see no one with those initials.

Only AD I remember is Anthony Drejaj.

-Adonys Henriquez arrived at SLU going by the nickname 'AD' so in Billikens.com-land it seems to make sense that we abbreviate the player by the same moniker the coach and his teammates may use, pretty simple

[ACE]

16 hours ago, thetorch said:

I didn't bring them up.

Bishop having a good Assist to To ratio gets repeatedly brought up.  I've continued to shoot down that assertion as false.

Then of course the strawman is presented bringing up other players Assist to TO ratio, which I also show as false.

Show me statistically why Bishop has any chance of being better than the 8th man in the rotation please.

The one guy said the ratio was "respectable"... your response was that it was "paltry."  Not sure how you showed it as "false." I think "respectable" is closer to the truth when that ratio is compared to other freshmen PGs. 

Not saying JB is a KM level player, but as a freshman KM had the benefit of playing with two of the top scorers in school history, so a lot of assist opportunities. Obviously JB had a horrible supporting cast during his freshman season. 

I've never argued Bishop will be anything more than the 8th man in the rotation on this team. I hope that is the case. It would mean we should have a heck of a team. We've had plenty of guards worse than Bishop over the years. For example, Soderberg never recruited a PG as good as Bishop.

[MusicCityBilliken]

2 minutes ago, Cowboy said:

-Adonys Henriquez arrived at SLU going by the nickname 'AD' so in Billikens.com-land it seems to make sense that we abbreviate the player by the same moniker the coach and his teammates may use, pretty simple

Thanks, wouldn't want to mix him up with Aaron Hines.

[BIG BILL FAN]

12 hours ago, billiken_roy said:

This is where you are wrong.  I would love they contribute.  I just believe they are far behind what ford has brought to the program.  If they are deeply  in the mix then I believe our success will be limited and our new players were not as good as most of us expected.

 

If they truly are as good as you apparently believe and we win the conference go to the tourney and they get drafted next summer that would be a great happening.  (Before you get all p!ssy about that hyperbole please I am just using the previous as exageration)  They will be immortalized in billiken history and honestly I'll be thrilled.    

Last I again want defend my crews venom.  I have now lived through the two worst coaches and periods in billiken history.  Ekker  and crews made some terrible moments for us.  Not only do I believe  crews was the worst of the two he somehow took the program when it was the highest in the program history and destroyed it almost immediately.

 

 I just cannot fathom how that happens and even more so how Any rabid fan can even remotely accept or tolerate it.  Excuse me if from a fandom standpoint I still boil from that happening.    

Dislike Crews all you want, but to carry that "venom" over to a player who was recruited by him is ridiculous. I've never made any definitive claims about Bishop or anyone else. Bishop has played for less than a year and a half and has had some good moments. Will he get better?????? Gee that would be a shocker for a young player to improve. I can remember many games that Lisch and Liddell played that were less than stellar when they were freshman and sophomores....I just have a hard time believing your statement that you want the "Crew's" guys to succeed, when you previously stated that you will be glad when there is "no evidence of them" ever being there.......

[SLU_Nick]

@BIG BILL FANI think the point being made is that if Bishop is playing big minutes then our recruiting success the past 18 months was greatly overstated.  Is it possible for a player who shined on a lousy team who was recruited by Jim Crews, Hofstra (maybe) and a number of D2 schools to elevate his game, and compete with top 100 recruits who had offers from Mich St?  Maybe/  But I would put those chances at less than 10%. 

If he was a Big man, then I would be more optimistic about his chances because big men take longer to mature.  The one tanglible disagreement that I have with the Bishop-defenders on this thread is his ability to shoot.  I do not remember him being much of a 3pt bomber.  I remember his mid-range game was decent against bad competiton.  That is about it.

 

[moytoy12]

12 hours ago, brianstl said:

I still haven't seen a good explanation for who Bishop will take the minutes from if he is going to play as much as some think.  Which of the guys that can fill either a role of a guard or wing will be sitting while Bishop gets all these minutes? Goodwin, AD, Bess, Roby, Johnson?  

Do people really think Graves is going to be buried on the bench when he is eligible?  You think Ford is going to bury the transfer he want hard after even though he already had the likes of Goodwin, AD, Roby, Bess and Bishop on the roster for the following season.

I think JJ will be the odd man out. Goodwin, Roby, Bishop (and then Graves) will be getting the majority of the minutes at the 1/2, which allows them to get 20-30 min on average each.  

AD and Bess will fill the 3. 

French, Foreman, Welmer and Anthony at the 4/5.  Bess will also likely get some minutes at the 4. 

 

[billikenfan05]

So we're all in agreement Adonys will go by Henny on this board? 

[hsmith19]

53 minutes ago, Cowboy said:

-Adonys Henriquez arrived at SLU going by the nickname 'AD' so in Billikens.com-land it seems to make sense that we abbreviate the player by the same moniker the coach and his teammates may use, pretty simple

Not simple at all. The initial system was around long before him and will be around long after. I don't think he has any idea the havoc this nickname will cause here. The "d" should at least not be capitalized. I am willing to accept "Ad."

[hsmith19]

1 hour ago, Pistol said:

JB1 = Bess and JB2 = Bishop?

It's a shame the "v" is not capitalized in Javon. That would be an easy fix. JVB and JB.

[wgstl]

3 hours ago, billikenbill said:

Seems like I recall a tweet with him being named the "win the week" winner early in the summer so I'm sure he's been practicing with the team.

according to his Instagram he's been in Greece ,for a long time. 

[Littlebill]

26 minutes ago, billikenfan05 said:

So we're all in agreement Adonys will go by Henny on this board? 

Can see it now - a turnover........

Blame it on the Henny
Blame it on the blue top
Got you feeling dizzy

[brianstl]

14 minutes ago, moytoy12 said:

I think JJ will be the odd man out. Goodwin, Roby, Bishop (and then Graves) will be getting the majority of the minutes at the 1/2, which allows them to get 20-30 min on average each.  

AD and Bess will fill the 3. 

French, Foreman, Welmer and Anthony at the 4/5.  Bess will also likely get some minutes at the 4. 

 

Thank you for an answer.  I don't necessarily agree, but you are actually thinking about were the minutes will come from.  I get the feeling that many just forget that more minutes for one player means less for someone else.  

It becomes a feel good thing to say a guy is going to play a lot and if you think differently it means that you are a mean person that hates the player.  The actual fact is hate/dislike has nothing to do with it, it just means you think someone else is going to get the minutes.  

I think there are too many guys that do too many things overall better than Bishop on both ends of the court for him to get a ton of minutes.  I could be wrong, it happens often.  Or, someone could get hurt and Bishop could play a ton. He is a far more attractive back up plan than most we have had in this past.

[wgstl]

Unless im missing something, where is everyone coming up with these minutes for Graves?  The rotation will be firmly set when he becomes eligible.  I haven't heard much about him being lights out in practice. He wasn't lights out at BC. Yes hes athletic, yes he probably have the best handles on the team. If goodwin shows he can handle point, I'm just not sure graves gets a ton of minutes.

 

I could be totally off on all of that.  Thats why Im wondering. 

[brianstl]

1 hour ago, ACE said:

The one guy said the ratio was "respectable"... your response was that it was "paltry."  Not sure how you showed it as "false." I think "respectable" is closer to the truth when that ratio is compared to other freshmen PGs. 

Not saying JB is a KM level player, but as a freshman KM had the benefit of playing with two of the top scorers in school history, so a lot of assist opportunities. Obviously JB had a horrible supporting cast during his freshman season. 

I've never argued Bishop will be anything more than the 8th man in the rotation on this team. I hope that is the case. It would mean we should have a heck of a team. We've had plenty of guards worse than Bishop over the years. For example, Soderberg never recruited a PG as good as Bishop.

Last season Bishop had 22.1% turnover rate.  Mitchell had a 14.5% his sophomore season.  That strips the assists opportunities completely out of the equation. Mitchell was far better at protecting the ball at the same point in their respective careers.

 

[moytoy12]

9 minutes ago, brianstl said:

Thank you for an answer.  I don't necessarily agree, but you are actually thinking about were the minutes will come from.  I get the feeling that many just forget that more minutes for one player means less for someone else.  

It becomes a feel good thing to say a guy is going to play a lot and if you think differently it means that you are a mean person that hates the player.  The actual fact is hate/dislike has nothing to do with it, it just means you think someone else is going to get the minutes.  

I think there are too many guys that do too many things overall better than Bishop on both ends of the court for him to get a ton of minutes.  I could be wrong, it happens often.  Or, someone could get hurt and Bishop could play a ton. He is a far more attractive back up plan than most we have had in this past.

It is nice to look at the roster and see how many solid options we have at each position.