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Recruiting - 2018 class


NextYearBill

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1 minute ago, Coach314 said:

I don't take the shots personally.  I find them amusing.  I am proud of Gordon no matter where he goes.  Gordon has been through a lot over the years.  I wish him the best.  If this is the University that is best for him then i am all for it.   I will still watch all the schools with local players.  I root for them all.

To me, this is kind of a BS cop-out into not saying you're happy Gordon chose SLU.  I don't necessarily think you'd be any happier if he chose Mizzou or think you're a Mizzou troll.  What I'm wondering is what makes someone a "local player"?  Did they need to be born in the St. Louis metro area?  Attend HS in the metro area?  Graduate from a metro area HS?  What geographic region makes the kid local?  Was Cassity (Pickneyville) a local?  What about Luke Meyer (Borgia)?  Does Pat McCaw still count as local since he went to CBC even though he transferred to and graduated from a HS in Maryland?  If a BEagles player transfers to a local HS for his Jr and Sr year is he local?  Do Jett, McCall, etc count as local since they attended SLU?

I guess I'm saying even your cop-out answer that seems clear is really vague.

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3 hours ago, SluSignGuy said:

Its impossible to remove them all, but I went through the last 100 or so posts and moved those focused on trolling to its own thread.  If you want to ***** and moan about trolling, go there.  If you want to legitimately talk about recruiting, do it here.

You did well Steve, this is fine.

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34 minutes ago, Spoon-Balls said:

 

Exactly. A pretty big thing that those schools we strive to be like do is that they get the high end local talent and showcase it for the region. Not only does it boost local pride, but it also makes the team as a whole feel more like the city's team. And this is only the beginning. If these guys that Ford brings in start going to the NBA, it has a wide ripple effect local players around here. People will start to look at the SLU program and viewing it through a completely different lens, a lens of legitimacy. 

I have enjoyed your posts and agree with what your saying, but the key here is "high end" local talent - not just local talent. Guys like McKissic and some of these other second tier players that the local AAU pimps are touting, aren't going to cut it. Players we've had from the past like Polk, Sloan and Meyer aren't going to get it done if we want to be on the level of a Xavier or Gonzaga. The key is to not lower our standards just to take a local kid. So far, Ford has aimed high and been very selective. IMO, the real key of programs like Xavier and Gonzaga is that they have been able to consistent land quality talent outside the region. That's really what I'm most encouraged by with Ford's approach - getting a player like French. Being in on a player like Rhoden. As long as we're in an East Coast league, we have to have an East Coast presence. Xavier understood that for all those years and Ford understands it as well. I think his previous experience in the A-10 is a real plus.

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1 minute ago, RUBillsFan said:

Do Jett, McCall, etc count as local since they attended SLU

This has always been my position. Once a kid chooses SLU, he's a "local player" in my book. But a sizable handful of people here have always seemed to feel more loyalty to the area high school scene than the SLU program itself.

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18 minutes ago, Coach314 said:

I don't take the shots personally.  I find them amusing.  I am proud of Gordon no matter where he goes.  Gordon has been through a lot over the years.  I wish him the best.  If this is the University that is best for him then i am all for it.   I will still watch all the schools with local players.  I root for them all.

It must be really hard for you to watch MVC games then with St Louis kids littered all over MVC rosters. Indiana State, Missouri State, SIU, Bradley, and Drake all have STL area guys on their rosters. How do you choose who to root for? Is it a points based system where you grade who is the most local? 

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8 minutes ago, RUBillsFan said:

To me, this is kind of a BS cop-out into not saying you're happy Gordon chose SLU.  I don't necessarily think you'd be any happier if he chose Mizzou or think you're a Mizzou troll.  What I'm wondering is what makes someone a "local player"?  Did they need to be born in the St. Louis metro area?  Attend HS in the metro area?  Graduate from a metro area HS?  What geographic region makes the kid local?  Was Cassity (Pickneyville) a local?  What about Luke Meyer (Borgia)?  Does Pat McCaw still count as local since he went to CBC even though he transferred to and graduated from a HS in Maryland?  If a BEagles player transfers to a local HS for his Jr and Sr year is he local?  Do Jett, McCall, etc count as local since they attended SLU?

I guess I'm saying even your cop-out answer that seems clear is really vague.

The numerous impassioned posts defending the honor of St. Martin tells you what this guy is about.

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Just now, ACE said:

The numerous impassioned posts defending the honor of St. Martin tells you what this guy is about.

I think he has the same vague loyalty to Martin as a "local player" and it might not have much to do with Mizzou.  I do think he has a ranking of schools in his head and where certain recruits should end up.  It is fairly obvious that Mizzou ranks higher on that list than SLU and thus in his mind is a better landing place for area recruits.  I don't necessarily think he cares or he may actually be happier if those recruits wind up at Duke or Kentucky.

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So, back to the topic at hand. If the coaching staff is able to close the deal with Rhoden the 2018 Class looks like:

  • Top 50, 4*, who is a beast in the block 
  • Top 200, 3*, regional/local kid who is known as an all-around bulldog 
  • Top 150, 3* dead-eye shooter from New York who had bigger offers from East Coast schools. 

That is pretty f'n sweet. 

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8 minutes ago, hsmith19 said:

Except there was pro football here for all but the beginning of the Spoonball run. And the Rams were the bright shiny new thing back then, not the faded has-been on the way our that they were in the Majerus/Crews years.

Regardless, it's one more thing that can't be used as an excuse now. Ditto for the "no local players" theory.

In addition to good reasons posters have mentioned, here are a couple others... or ones I'd like to emphasize:

1) Spoon was a indeed a tremendous interview. He could sell. Majerus usually wasn't and didn't. (I did like his quotes on quality of SLU education)

2) SLU under Spoon was newsworthy. Getting them to the Big Dance was nearly unthinkable at the time, making it fun for fans to get on bandwagon. Today, a bit of been there, done that...

3) Keeping good coaches and recruiting new ones was much more difficult back in day. No building. Little money. Showing recruits West Pine Gym was like recruiting with arm tied behind back. I always wondered if Rich, Charlie, Lorenzo, Brad would have had more recruiting success/stayed longer if Biondi had built Chaifetz earlier..

4) Given 16,000+ average attendance under Spoon, still kills me they didn't build Chaifetz bigger. I understand original plan included second deck but had to be killed due to unbudgeted practice facility and concerns with ground underneath Chaifetz. Regardless, while they won't average that number moving forward, if program begins drawing well again, Scottrade and the dome just down the street for select dates.

Summarizing, it's a different and more sustainable environment today. Major financial commitment from University and key donors made it so. With fine coach who is outstanding recruiter and good media guy in place, and handful of top local recruits as cherry on top -- and wide open spot in top 20 market with no NBA team -- could be a lot of fun.

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2018 recruiting is going to be kind of slow until official visits are set up. Jared Rhoden is still in the process of fielding in-home visits so we're probably several weeks away from him setting up an official visit. Mickey Pearson has already expressed that he wants to take an official visit to SLU but don't expect the staff to set that up until after Rhoden visits campus. And if Talen Horton-Tucker wants to make an official visit, you get him on campus as soon as possible.

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26 minutes ago, Adman said:

4) Given 16,000+ average attendance under Spoon, still kills me they didn't build Chaifetz bigger. I understand original plan included second deck but had to be killed due to unbudgeted practice facility and concerns with ground underneath Chaifetz. Regardless, while they won't average that number moving forward, if program begins drawing well again, Scottrade and the dome just down the street for select dates.

You had me until point number 4. The bigger is better approach was a 80's-90's sports venue concept. These days, the key is to finding the optimal size to (a) create the best game-day atmosphere, and (b) help drive an optimal demand v. supply. Adding more seats does nothing but create a cavern for most, if not at all, games. Nobody cares that Cameron Indoor has limited seats, but everyone raves about the electric atmosphere. 

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9 minutes ago, davidnark said:

You had me until point number 4. The bigger is better approach was a 80's-90's sports venue concept. These days, the key is to finding the optimal size to (a) create the best game-day atmosphere, and (b) help drive an optimal demand v. supply. Adding more seats does nothing but create a cavern for most, if not at all, games. Nobody cares that Cameron Indoor has limited seats, but everyone raves about the electric atmosphere. 

+1

The culture in 2017 (multitude of distractions) doesnt lend itself to filling up 16k seats for a college basketball game sans a handful of games each year.  10k was the perfect size.

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53 minutes ago, Adman said:

 

4) Given 16,000+ average attendance under Spoon, still kills me they didn't build Chaifetz bigger. I understand original plan included second deck but had to be killed due to unbudgeted practice facility and concerns with ground underneath Chaifetz. Regardless, while they won't average that number moving forward, if program begins drawing well again, Scottrade and the dome just down the street for select dates.

 

-my name is not Chaifetz but I did not donate to the arena fund or whatever it was and I don't donate every year to move games out of Chaifetz Arena, just my take, but I don't schedule Duke, UNC, UCLA, KU, UK or anyone if they want the game in StL but not in our building...unless in the tourney 

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2 hours ago, QUAILMAN said:

I have always really liked 247 sports' crystal ball.  After seeing seven different recruiting "experts" flip Gordon to Mizzou, I think I am going to call it quits with them.  They seem to know just as much as a casual message board or tweet reader.  They just jump on the bandwagon and do whatever they can to earn points despite not actually knowing anything.

Those are my feelings on most "experts" outside of academia. Every year I save the PD's predictions for MLB and NHL. Laughable how off they always are. Same with that 144 BS. Any casual fan could come up with a list that broad and come close to the % they get correct.

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3 minutes ago, RiseAndGrind said:

Kind of funny that Torrence Watson announced his commitment to Mizzou by saying "HOME" with a picture of the arch, then Carte'Are reaffirmed his commitment by capitalizing "HOME" after Saint Louis University. I'm just going to assume Gordon was throwing massive shade at Watson. 

lol. I got to think you're thinking way to into that

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5 minutes ago, wgstl said:

lol. I got to think you're thinking way to into that

idk, the thought crossed my mind as well.  I don't buy that Watson just wanted to be close to home.  Mr. Integrity came in with some shady stuff and changed his mind.  If he wanted to be close to home, he'd have come to SLU.

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