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Recruiting - 2018 class


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14 hours ago, Glorydays2013 said:

Look at his twitter. It's all retweets of mizzou stuff

I kind of thought it would probably go that way but it would be a nice get.

SLU seems to be in good shape going into 2018 with guards and big men as long as the verbal commits from Thatch and Gordon remain.

Is SLU now looking for the best player to commit or is there a specific need for 2018.

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3 hours ago, CBFan said:

I kind of thought it would probably go that way but it would be a nice get.

SLU seems to be in good shape going into 2018 with guards and big men as long as the verbal commits from Thatch and Gordon remain.

Is SLU now looking for the best player to commit or is there a specific need for 2018.

Not doubting Ford at all, but I wonder if it actually gets a little bit more difficult to recruit for that last 2018 scholarship.  The main thing SLU had to offer was playing time.  Recruits looked at the dearth of talent and knew they could play right away.  SLU can't offer that anymore.  We've kind of seen that in the past when SLU stacks a few good / decent recruiting classes, but can't stack more talent on top.

Examples:

In 2004 Soderberg brought in Luke Meyer, Danny Brown, Dwayne Polk, and Bryce Husak.  Kind of meh in hindsight, but this was a decent Soderberg class.  Meyer & Brown were serviceable and everyone had higher expectations for Polk.  In 2005, he brought in Lisch & Liddell.  In 2006, without playing time to offer, Soderberg struggled to recruit and brought in Obi Ikeakor, Horace Dixon, Adam Knollmeyer, and Dustin Macguire.  His 2007 class before getting canned was Anthony Mitchell and Marcus Relphorde.

Majerus was able to stack some decent classses because the players that weren't very good left.  2008 Conklin, Cassity, Kwamain, Reed, Cotto, Thompson.  2009 Ellis, Remekun, Femi John, Justin Jordan, Jon Smith, Jeff Reid, Christian Salecich.  2010 Evans, Jett, Loe, McCall.  However, once the deck was pretty much full after the 2010 class all turned out good in 2011 it was Glaze and Manning and 2012 was Keith Carter & Jared Drew.

Admittedly these situations were totally different circumstances.  Soderberg was a long time ago and he was a poor recruiter overall.  Health issues may have had an impact on Majerus recruiting.  

I'm just saying is that what happens with remaining 2018 scholarships and 2019 scholarships will go a very long way toward showing whether Travis Ford can sustain success year after year or if we're going to continue on a bit of a roller coaster ride.

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Carter wasn't necessarily a bad recruit for Majerus though. He might have turned out a lot better with Majerus here - same with Manning (maybe). 

Those later Majerus classes also suffered from the huge classes before. The large classes have a better chance of hitting 3/5 or 4/6 than a class of just two guys. Also huge classes screw up the flow of new guys coming in and developing. It's a hard balance. 

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Only top 10 programs can bring in top classes year after year after year. Everybody else has to be content with bringing in an average class every 2/3 years. If the recruiting services would have counted our transfers, we would be credited with far and away the best recruiting class in the A10 for 3 years running (2016, 2017, 2018). The odds are very strong that will not continue. There's a strong recruiter in Columbia that has plenty of playing time to offer and another guy in Champaign that makes the tournament every year. If we land another top tier class in 2019 that's great, but I'm not expecting it.

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26 minutes ago, RUBillsFan said:

Not doubting Ford at all, but I wonder if it actually gets a little bit more difficult to recruit for that last 2018 scholarship.  The main thing SLU had to offer was playing time.  Recruits looked at the dearth of talent and knew they could play right away.  SLU can't offer that anymore.  We've kind of seen that in the past when SLU stacks a few good / decent recruiting classes, but can't stack more talent on top.

Examples:

In 2004 Soderberg brought in Luke Meyer, Danny Brown, Dwayne Polk, and Bryce Husak.  Kind of meh in hindsight, but this was a decent Soderberg class.  Meyer & Brown were serviceable and everyone had higher expectations for Polk.  In 2005, he brought in Lisch & Liddell.  In 2006, without playing time to offer, Soderberg struggled to recruit and brought in Obi Ikeakor, Horace Dixon, Adam Knollmeyer, and Dustin Macguire.  His 2007 class before getting canned was Anthony Mitchell and Marcus Relphorde.

Majerus was able to stack some decent classses because the players that weren't very good left.  2008 Conklin, Cassity, Kwamain, Reed, Cotto, Thompson.  2009 Ellis, Remekun, Femi John, Justin Jordan, Jon Smith, Jeff Reid, Christian Salecich.  2010 Evans, Jett, Loe, McCall.  However, once the deck was pretty much full after the 2010 class all turned out good in 2011 it was Glaze and Manning and 2012 was Keith Carter & Jared Drew.

Admittedly these situations were totally different circumstances.  Soderberg was a long time ago and he was a poor recruiter overall.  Health issues may have had an impact on Majerus recruiting.  

I'm just saying is that what happens with remaining 2018 scholarships and 2019 scholarships will go a very long way toward showing whether Travis Ford can sustain success year after year or if we're going to continue on a bit of a roller coaster ride.

I don't think Sodie didn't have playing time to offer in 2006. He was set at the 2 & 3 with Lisch and Liddell, but he had a LOT of playing time to offer a couple of bigs and a point guard. Obviously with Obi, Horace and Knollmeyer he failed miserably to land some decent bigs. And signing Maguire, when you really needed to upgrade the PG position was a strange decision. That 2006 class was Sodie's downfall. He failed to surround Lisch and Liddell with quality players.

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A lot of offer list updates were posted to the Recruiting Lists thread for your perusal. No major news, mostly just a few offers here and there for guys. Wynston Tabbs wins the award for most new offers this month, with 7.

I also found this article when looking into SLU offer Demarius Jacobs, the kid who got out of his LOI from SIUC and reclassified as a 2018 recruit so he could play with his brother Markese at Hillcrest Prep in Arizona. Turns out Hillcrest, with its $35,000 tuition, is a sham school that offers little beyond basketball. Players weren't fed well, the "dorms" are a few apartments where players sleep on mattresses on the floor, and the coursework is through a separate online charter school. However, the contents of the article are in dispute, as the school alleges the quotes come from parents of players who were kicked out for disciplinary reasons - 5 kids were involved in an armed robbery - but they have plenty of quotes from people not involved. I'm not sure what this means, if anything, for the Jacobs brothers but Markese is a high-level player who committed early to Kansas.

These charter schools are completely unregulated and most of them seem to be offering sub-standard education. Since more and more keep popping up as state governments push voucher programs and continue to lack oversight, this problem isn't going away anytime soon. These have been around for a while but the issue is exploding and it doesn't appear the NCAA is doing much of anything about it. I guess they could refuse eligibility to kids with diplomas from sham schools, de-incentivizing kids to attend, and maybe that would turn up the pressure on the schools to become legitimate or disappear.

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18 minutes ago, Pistol said:

A lot of offer list updates were posted to the Recruiting Lists thread for your perusal. No major news, mostly just a few offers here and there for guys. Wynston Tabbs wins the award for most new offers this month, with 7.

I also found this article when looking into SLU offer Demarius Jacobs, the kid who got out of his LOI from SIUC and reclassified as a 2018 recruit so he could play with his brother Markese at Hillcrest Prep in Arizona. Turns out Hillcrest, with its $35,000 tuition, is a sham school that offers little beyond basketball. Players weren't fed well, the "dorms" are a few apartments where players sleep on mattresses on the floor, and the coursework is through a separate online charter school. However, the contents of the article are in dispute, as the school alleges the quotes come from parents of players who were kicked out for disciplinary reasons - 5 kids were involved in an armed robbery - but they have plenty of quotes from people not involved. I'm not sure what this means, if anything, for the Jacobs brothers but Markese is a high-level player who committed early to Kansas.

These charter schools are completely unregulated and most of them seem to be offering sub-standard education. Since more and more keep popping up as state governments push voucher programs and continue to lack oversight, this problem isn't going away anytime soon. These have been around for a while but the issue is exploding and it doesn't appear the NCAA is doing much of anything about it. I guess they could refuse eligibility to kids with diplomas from sham schools, de-incentivizing kids to attend, and maybe that would turn up the pressure on the schools to become legitimate or disappear.

Interesting point - I guess from what you said that the Trump budget with DeVos ideas to support more of these types of schools will only make it worse.

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39 minutes ago, cheeseman said:

Interesting point - I guess from what you said that the Trump budget with DeVos ideas to support more of these types of schools will only make it worse.

Back in 2001, when I started at SLU, Randy Pulley came from a school called Word of God in Raleigh, NC. The school was founded in 1993 as a private school, well before the charter school boom. He struggled mightily with regard to academics at SLU, and I'm not sure how many credit hours he brought to the Juco he spent a year at before Mizzou, but I think it was in the single digits. He said they basically did nothing at his school in terms of academics. It was a complete joke. He was there to play basketball and football, period. Now, I can't say what the founder's (read about him on their site by the way - hoo, boy) original intent was for academics, I can't say whether non-athletes (there aren't many) get a decent education, and I can't say how academics have changed in the 15+ years since Pulley graduated. But it's clear that there wasn't much to the school's mission outside of sports and preaching.

Fast forward to 2017 and there are thousands of charter schools around the country with a lower barrier to entry than a private school like and just as little oversight. They were billed to the public as the great alternative to failing public schools, but instead of out-achieving those failing schools, they've almost immediately become a second track of failing educational institutions, occupying the uncomfortable space between public and private.

I don't want to veer into the political here. My main point is that there have been 'fake' schools around for a while that are little more than a shell around an athletic program, but in the past several years, with the explosion of charter schools, it's easier than ever to put together a basketball program and work backwards, setting up an inadequate school around it. Given that the trend is not just continuing, but growing, the NCAA is going to have to address this.

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2 hours ago, Pistol said:

Back in 2001, when I started at SLU, Randy Pulley came from a school called Word of God in Raleigh, NC. The school was founded in 1993 as a private school, well before the charter school boom. He struggled mightily with regard to academics at SLU, and I'm not sure how many credit hours he brought to the Juco he spent a year at before Mizzou, but I think it was in the single digits. He said they basically did nothing at his school in terms of academics. It was a complete joke. He was there to play basketball and football, period. Now, I can't say what the founder's (read about him on their site by the way - hoo, boy) original intent was for academics, I can't say whether non-athletes (there aren't many) get a decent education, and I can't say how academics have changed in the 15+ years since Pulley graduated. But it's clear that there wasn't much to the school's mission outside of sports and preaching.

Fast forward to 2017 and there are thousands of charter schools around the country with a lower barrier to entry than a private school like and just as little oversight. They were billed to the public as the great alternative to failing public schools, but instead of out-achieving those failing schools, they've almost immediately become a second track of failing educational institutions, occupying the uncomfortable space between public and private.

I don't want to veer into the political here. My main point is that there have been 'fake' schools around for a while that are little more than a shell around an athletic program, but in the past several years, with the explosion of charter schools, it's easier than ever to put together a basketball program and work backwards, setting up an inadequate school around it. Given that the trend is not just continuing, but growing, the NCAA is going to have to address this.

Well mine was not a political statement - simply an observation. 

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Frank had Bobby McCormack, Priory head coach, and Blake Ahearn,  in studio and talked about SLU in the last segment.  Blake talked about Gordon and how much of a beast he is.  Priory played Sikeston so McCormack talked about Thatch and how they did everything they could to contain him but couldn't.  Said he's a big body, just moves through people and he finishes at the rim with massive dunks and can still shoot it.  Desmet also played him and Blake talked about his size and how is like a fullback, he really likes him.  

Similar to what others have said on here, another great fit in the team that will just be pushing people around in the A10.  

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9 minutes ago, Bills_06 said:

Frank had Bobby McCormack, Priory head coach, and Blake Ahearn,  in studio and talked about SLU in the last segment.  Blake talked about Gordon and how much of a beast he is.  Priory played Sikeston so McCormack talked about Thatch and how they did everything they could to contain him but couldn't.  Said he's a big body, just moves through people and he finishes at the rim with massive dunks and can still shoot it.  Desmet also played him and Blake talked about his size and how is like a fullback, he really likes him.  

Similar to what others have said on here, another great fit in the team that will just be pushing people around in the A10.  

I also heard the show. They were very positive on Travis. Couldn't understand why SLU and Mo. don't play each other. I only wish the fall signing date was today. 

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4 hours ago, Pistol said:

there have been 'fake' schools around for a while that are little more than a shell around an athletic program

Not to lambast you, and I don't care about the politics of it, but the problem is that this is a good way to describe many failing public schools, just remove the words 'athletic program'.

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There are charter schools here in Baltimore that are outperforming the public schools.  But that's not really hard to do ---- on a scale of one to ten you can garner a "1"  and still outperform some B'more public schools.  Some are posting negative numbers its that bad.  Carl Stokes, a long time B'more city Democratic councilman gave up his seat to devote his time to a charter school.  Seems to be at least one "good" alternative.

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Guys there are good schools and bad schools, just like there are good students and bad students, and good parents and bad parents. The actual title or name of the school has little to do with whether they are good or bad, neither does their budget or physical facilities. Do not ask me to give examples, think of them yourselves.

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16 hours ago, AnkielBreakers said:

Not to lambast you, and I don't care about the politics of it, but the problem is that this is a good way to describe many failing public schools, just remove the words 'athletic program'.

I'm not sure I quite understand 100% of your point, but at least failing public schools started out as actual schools and only failed later.

Many are currently seizing an opportunity to run a fly-by-night athletic program disguised as a school, and it's not good for anyone, save for maybe a few shady individuals who know they can basically steal tuition money with no tax or oversight. Maybe part of my viewpoint here has to do with how bad it is in the state I live in, but it's happening everywhere. Not all are scams, not all are bad, not all are forgoing academics altogether for sports - but a disproportionate number are problematic in at least one major way.

If more and more kids are going to these places with their sights on college sports scholarships, it's going to become a bigger problem for the NCAA. I'm really curious to see how the mess at Hillcrest Prep plays out, and how this plays out on a larger scale.

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On 1/19/2015 at 7:24 AM, TheChosenOne said:

Carte'Are Gordon continued his strong freshman season this weekend in Columbia leading Vianney to an overtime victory over Michael Porter Jr. and Father Tolton. Gordon went for 27 points (10-23 from the field and 7-11 from the line) and had 12 rebounds. Michael Porter Jr. had 23 points (8-16) and 10 rebounds.

just revisiting old posts... found this one to be timely 

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