Jason Whitlock Mentions the Bills

[Box and Won]

In today's column:

Time to end Braggin’ Rights rivalry

By JASON WHITLOCK

The Kansas City Star

ST. LOUIS | Drop the series. Let the Fighting Illini brag. They’ve earned it.

On paper, this Braggin’ Rights rivalry makes a lot of sense. The Missouri Tigers and Illinois Fighting Illini meet once a year on the basketball court in St. Louis. Half the arena is orange and the other half is black. The ESPN family of networks televises the event. Big-name broadcasters call the game.

It’s a showcase … for Illinois, 75-59 winners Tuesday night at the Scottrade Center.

That’s nine in a row for the Illini. They’re now 20-8 in Braggin’ Rights games. They can lose the next two or three and keep on bragging. I’d rather see the Tigers take on Saint Louis University in an annual battle. They’d probably muster more emotion for the Billikens.

[dewey33]

In today's column:

Mike Alden has had the offer to play the Billikens on his desk since Soderberg's first year.

Its his choice...full house vs the Billikens or 3K vs Coppin State.

Plus, if they are so good, it would be an east "W" for them.

I would say its a win-win for Mizzou...lol

[cheeseman]

Mike Alden has had the offer to play the Billikens on his desk since Soderberg's first year.

Its his choice...full house vs the Billikens or 3K vs Coppin State.

Plus, if they are so good, it would be an east "W" for them.

I would say its a win-win for Mizzou...lol

I am not so sure that the issue is that we only go and play at Columbia - we could probably get that. The issue is that they would have to come to SLU to play and that is what they are unwilling to do.

[Box and Won]

I am not so sure that the issue is that we only go and play at Columbia - we could probably get that. The issue is that they would have to come to SLU to play and that is what they are unwilling to do.

I think they would come here, but would want a 2-for-1 deal, with two games in CoMo.

[billikenfan05]

THEY ARE P*****!!!! END OF STORY!

[ACE]

Well they tried it a while back - we beat them in one, had them beat in Columbia until we started clanking free throws down the stretch and then lost at home on a last second shot to that kid with a bad hair-doo... so then they got scared, put their Tiger tails between their legs and won't play us anymore.

No way should we give these losers 2 for 1. We got 1-1s with Boston College, North Carolina, Arizona, UCLA among others, so there is NO reason to give a program like Mi$$ouri that deal.

[J.J. Loscutoff]

Plus, as I recall, didn't we already give them a 2-1 when Quinny the Pooh was there?

Also, given the way the Tigers draw in St. Louis, they would probably draw more of their "fans" here (at Scott) than they would in BoCoMo.

Of course, MU is not the only team that will not play SLU 1-1. Coach (I have read) has offered to play Illinois, KU, etc. They all have declined. So, why not try to get the best Catholic schools here? Gonzaga, Notre Dame, Georgetown, BC, etc. would be great, too.

[ACE]

Gonzaga... that's yet another program better than Mi$$ouri that gave us a 1-1.

[huzzah]

Plus, as I recall, didn't we already give them a 2-1 when Quinny the Pooh was there?

Also, given the way the Tigers draw in St. Louis, they would probably draw more of their "fans" here (at Scott) than they would in BoCoMo.

Of course, MU is not the only team that will not play SLU 1-1. Coach (I have read) has offered to play Illinois, KU, etc. They all have declined. So, why not try to get the best Catholic schools here? Gonzaga, Notre Dame, Georgetown, BC, etc. would be great, too.

Here is my proposal. Have a holiday tournament in St. Louis. Invite SIU-Edwardswille, SIU, SE Missouri, Missouri State, UMKC, Missouri, and SLU. Have it at Scott. I think it will sell out. The tournament will sell out and it gives SLU a chance to pick up some Div 1 victories. Compare participating in this tournament to our being in the Las Vegas tournament that we just completed. According to T. Timmerman, the audience there was about 200 regardless of who played. The court was on top of ice, like Scott, but there was not any heat and TT froze. Scott is more confortable.

[dewey33]

Here is my proposal. Have a holiday tournament in St. Louis. Invite SIU-Edwardswille, SIU, SE Missouri, Missouri State, UMKC, Missouri, and SLU. Have it at Scott. I think it will sell out. The tournament will sell out and it gives SLU a chance to pick up some Div 1 victories. Compare participating in this tournament to our being in the Las Vegas tournament that we just completed. According to T. Timmerman, the audience there was about 200 regardless of who played. The court was on top of ice, like Scott, but there was not any heat and TT froze. Scott is more confortable.

The Sports Commission would eat that up...

[Box and Won]

had them beat in Columbia until we started clanking free throws down the stretch.

That was so close to being a great game. Seemed like we self-destructed after Tatum busted out the "throat slash" gesture. I was so (upset) after that loss.

The third game was an absolute heartbreaker. I think Mizzou was ranked very high at the time.

[jjray]

I am not so sure that the issue is that we only go and play at Columbia - we could probably get that. The issue is that they would have to come to SLU to play and that is what they are unwilling to do.

I think we should offer that the game in St. Louis be on a neutral court (ScotTrade). Mizzou should go for that. Forget 2 for 1.

[cheeseman]

Plus, as I recall, didn't we already give them a 2-1 when Quinny the Pooh was there?

Also, given the way the Tigers draw in St. Louis, they would probably draw more of their "fans" here (at Scott) than they would in BoCoMo.

Of course, MU is not the only team that will not play SLU 1-1. Coach (I have read) has offered to play Illinois, KU, etc. They all have declined. So, why not try to get the best Catholic schools here? Gonzaga, Notre Dame, Georgetown, BC, etc. would be great, too.

It was not a 2-1 deal - we played the first game at the Dome which was suppose to be a neutral site, then the second one in Columbia with the third one at Scott Trade. Apparently the other Catholic schools have no interest in playing us. Obviously we just finished a 1-1 with BC but Gonzaga has told us that they want to play other schools rather than play us again on a 1-1 and ND's sh#t does not stink so they do not want to have anything to do with us either.

[cheeseman]

I think we should offer that the game in St. Louis be on a neutral court (ScotTrade). Mizzou should go for that. Forget 2 for 1.

Under no circumstances would I consider a game at Scott Trade our home court game and still have to go to Columbia. They want to play a single game with us at Scott Trade then fine but if it is a 1-1 we play our came in StL Chaifetz just as they play their game at their home court.

[cheeseman]

Here is my proposal. Have a holiday tournament in St. Louis. Invite SIU-Edwardswille, SIU, SE Missouri, Missouri State, UMKC, Missouri, and SLU. Have it at Scott. I think it will sell out. The tournament will sell out and it gives SLU a chance to pick up some Div 1 victories. Compare participating in this tournament to our being in the Las Vegas tournament that we just completed. According to T. Timmerman, the audience there was about 200 regardless of who played. The court was on top of ice, like Scott, but there was not any heat and TT froze. Scott is more confortable.

I have little interest in playing all the teams in one year or some grouping. That kind of a situation only really benefits SIUE , and SMS. MO has nothing to gain and UMKC would see it as buy games with them getting no money unless it rotated between KC and StL. For SIU they get nothing out it really and neither do we since there would be no assurances that we would get MO to play against in the tourney. Looks good on paper but not in practice.

[RB2.0]

I would love to see Majerus start the Mizzu/SLU game up again. It is a "natural and geographical" rivalry for us. Mizzu isn't any good so their stigma about being too good to play SLU is just rediculous. I think they need a reality check and hopefully they got it.

[brianstl]

I have little interest in playing all the teams in one year or some grouping. That kind of a situation only really benefits SIUE , and SMS. MO has nothing to gain and UMKC would see it as buy games with them getting no money unless it rotated between KC and StL. For SIU they get nothing out it really and neither do we since there would be no assurances that we would get MO to play against in the tourney. Looks good on paper but not in practice.

BS. That is the line you always hear, but there is no proof that it hurts any of the bigger programs. Can you name one school that has been hurt when they choose to play or were force to play a regional rival?

[cheeseman]

BS. That is the line you always hear, but there is no proof that it hurts any of the bigger programs. Can you name one school that has been hurt when they choose to play or were force to play a regional rival?

First of all I never said the bigger programs would be hurt just that they would get nothing out it. Big difference between no positive impact and getting hurt. My point simply was teams have to believe they are getting something of value out of a scheduling and if one does not then the match up will not happen. This can strictly be subjective on their part but their perception is their reality.

[NH]

First of all I never said the bigger programs would be hurt just that they would get nothing out it. Big difference between no positive impact and getting hurt. My point simply was teams have to believe they are getting something of value out of a scheduling and if one does not then the match up will not happen. This can strictly be subjective on their part but their perception is their reality.

Im pretty sure all those schools, sans maybe UMKC, recruit out of the St. Louis area. sO they get to play a couple games against recruiting rivals in one of the main places they are recruiting.

[lefty]

Im pretty sure all those schools, sans maybe UMKC, recruit out of the St. Louis area. sO they get to play a couple games against recruiting rivals in one of the main places they are recruiting.

All you have to do is to answer truthfully why SLU wants to play Missouri and/or Illinois and you'll begin to understand their stance.

[cheeseman]

Im pretty sure all those schools, sans maybe UMKC, recruit out of the St. Louis area. sO they get to play a couple games against recruiting rivals in one of the main places they are recruiting.

That is my point exactly - SIUE gains the most. UMKC might recruit but they are not big players in this area for kids. SIUC - they get to play in StL every two years against us and they come yearly for the MVC Tourney so they don't need anymore exposure here. SMS - same boat as SIUC for the most part. Missouri - they play the Braggin Right game every year. Except for SIUE - and possibly SLU if they could draw Missouri every year not much good for the others.

[NH]

That is my point exactly - SIUE gains the most. UMKC might recruit but they are not big players in this area for kids. SIUC - they get to play in StL every two years against us and they come yearly for the MVC Tourney so they don't need anymore exposure here. SMS - same boat as SIUC for the most part. Missouri - they play the Braggin Right game every year. Except for SIUE - and possibly SLU if they could draw Missouri every year not much good for the others.

I agree it is tough for UMKC. However, Issee the advantages for every other school involved. THis whole thread is based on the premise that bragguin rights is not productive for Missouri. WOuldnt they rather win a tournament against local schools in a recruiting area than get killed by illinois in the same area.

[cheeseman]

I agree it is tough for UMKC. However, Issee the advantages for every other school involved. THis whole thread is based on the premise that bragguin rights is not productive for Missouri. WOuldnt they rather win a tournament against local schools in a recruiting area than get killed by illinois in the same area.

Apparently not or they would stop renewing the series. Even though they have lost 9 in a row some of the games have been right down to the wire so it looks worse then it really is. I think if I was MU I would feel better about playing and maybe beating IL rather than beating UMKC and SIUE - although I think MU does play SIUE this year in Columbia. They clearly have no interest in playing SIUC, SMS or SLU.

[cheesycow]

I would love to see Majerus start the Mizzu/SLU game up again. It is a "natural and geographical" rivalry for us. Mizzu isn't any good so their stigma about being too good to play SLU is just rediculous. I think they need a reality check and hopefully they got it.

it has nothing to do with being too good to play slu, it has to do with no one in columbia giving a crap. If you're from KC you're interested in KU/MU, if you're from St. Louis you're interested in Illinois/MU. The game just isn't as big of a draw as you think it is, because SLU isn't our natural rival, our artificial rival, or even a school we dislike.

[billiken_roy]

it has nothing to do with being too good to play slu, it has to do with no one in columbia giving a crap. If you're from KC you're interested in KU/MU, if you're from St. Louis you're interested in Illinois/MU. The game just isn't as big of a draw as you think it is, because SLU isn't our natural rival, our artificial rival, or even a school we dislike.

yes it is such an unpopular game that in the two games between saint louis university and mi$$ouri that were in st louis in 1999 and 2001 the attendance numbers were 25,790 and 20,602. both higher than the game last week between mi$$ouri and illinois.

you want to try again.